Call The Damn Leads

David Aferiat – Co-Founder (Exited FinTech), Executive Coach, Leadership Strategist, The Avid Group
 
 
Episode Summary
In Episode 140, Drewbie sits down with David Aferiat, a seasoned entrepreneur who spent 20 years building and scaling a FinTech software company before successfully exiting—and now helps founders and leadership teams navigate growth, culture, and scale without breaking themselves in the process.
David shares the behind-the-scenes reality of landing massive enterprise deals with companies like E*TRADE, TD Ameritrade, Schwab, and Interactive Brokers—and why closing the deal is often the easy part. The real challenge? What happens after you win.
This conversation goes deep into leadership identity, scaling pains, values-driven decision-making, and why every time you double your business, you break it—and why that's actually a good thing.
From redefining perseverance, to building meetings that don't suck, to reframing leadership as a guide on the hero's journey, this episode is a masterclass for founders, sales leaders, and executives navigating growth.
 
 
Episode Highlights
Selling and licensing FinTech software to major enterprise platforms



Why landing big clients forces you to rebuild your company from the inside out



"Every time you double your business, you break it" — and why that matters



The shift from one-to-one selling to one-to-many decision-makers



How enterprise sales change customer service, product development, and staffing



Managing identity after a successful exit from a 20-year business



Why anchoring identity in values—not roles—is critical for leaders



Redefining perseverance as daily rituals toward a better future version of yourself



Designing meetings that create momentum instead of draining energy



The danger of endless one-on-one meetings and weak leadership structures



Building mutual accountability through team-based problem solving



The "toothbrush test" for leadership alignment and daily focus



Why employees—not customers—are the real heroes of the business



Leadership as a guide, not the hero, in the organization



How values become the filter for hiring, promoting, and firing



Using assessments to uncover hidden friction in sales, marketing, and operations



Simplifying, prioritizing, executing, and communicating as leadership fundamentals



 
 
Key Takeaways
1. Scaling always breaks the company—and that's normal.
Every growth stage requires rebuilding systems, roles, and processes from scratch.
2. Big deals don't just change revenue—they change everything.
Customer service, R&D, staffing, and accountability all shift at scale.
3. Your identity must outlive your title.
Founders who anchor identity to roles struggle after exits or transitions.
4. Values are revealed through decisions, not websites.
Real values show up in how leaders hire, fire, promote, and prioritize.
5. Perseverance is not burnout—it's intentional daily rituals.
Success comes from designing habits aligned with a future version of yourself.
6. Meetings should build momentum, not resentment.
Well-run weekly leadership meetings drive clarity, accountability, and speed.
7. Weak leaders hide in one-on-ones.
Strong leaders build alignment and accountability in the group.
8. Your team are the heroes—you are the guide.
Leaders exist to empower others to win, not to be the star.
9. Psychological safety unlocks execution.
When teams trust each other, problems surface faster and solutions follow.
10. Simplify → Prioritize → Execute → Communicate.
Leadership doesn't have to be complicated—but it must be intentional.
 
 
Connect with David
🔗 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidaferiat/
🏢 Company: The Avid Group
📍 Atlanta, GA
David regularly shares leadership insights, growth frameworks, and reflections on the hero's journey for founders and executives.
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🎯 Call to Action
Call The Damn Leads
"By sales professionals, for sales professionals - Tales of your wildest sales stories and tactics to succeed in your sales career across various industries."
Join Drewbie Wilson, a sales veteran with over 20 years of experience, as he brings you insider stories, humor, and actionable strategies to excel in your sales journey.
Your weekly dose of:
Wild Sales Stories: Engaging tales of real-life sales adventures.

Proven Tactics: Actionable strategies to boost your sales game.

Humor: A fun and energetic perspective on the world of sales.

Expert Insights: Learn from seasoned professionals in various industries.

Don't miss out on the insights, humor, and strategies that can take your sales career to new heights! Sales professionals, entrepreneurs, and small business owners striving to enhance their sales, marketing, and personal growth to achieve financial success and time freedom.
If you'd like to be a guest on our show please leave your contact information and a brief message selling us on what makes your story worth sharing!
https://callthedamnleads.com/pages/podcast
Follow Drewbie: https://www.facebook.com/drewbierides

Follow Call The Damn Leads: https://www.instagram.com/callthedamnleads

In this episode of Call The Damn Leads, I sit down with my guy Ethan Dowie, founder of Indigo and one of the sharpest minds in the branded-merch game. Ethan didn't come into the industry with experience, money, or a fancy network… he came in with a cell phone, a notebook, and the willingness to make 500 cold calls.
And on call #496, everything changed.
That single outreach — one conversation with a buyer at Zappos — turned into hundreds of thousands of dollars in orders and opened the door to a multi-six-figure merch company built on systems, relationships, and high-touch service.
Ethan and I break down what it really takes to win in sales when you're starting from scratch, how to use merch the right way as a growth tool, and why quality > quantity in every part of your business.
If you've ever doubted yourself, if you've ever been tempted to quit before you hit that breakthrough, or if you're trying to figure out how to scale a brand from "one good client" to a real business — this episode is your sign.
 
 
Episode Highlights
💥 Cold Call #496 — The One That Changed Everything
Ethan went 0 for 400+ calls before landing Zappos. One swing changed the trajectory of his company — and proved the power of persistence.
📈 Slow, Steady, and Systematized Growth
Before scaling, Ethan became the only employee he needed — learning everything himself, documenting the process, and turning each lesson into SOPs.
🎨 Why Most Merch Fails (And How to Fix It)
Ethan shares why brands get merch wrong: they start with the product, not the outcome. Reverse engineer the purpose, then design with intention.
🎁 Merch as a Sales Tool, Not a Vanity Project
Done right, merch builds brand equity, creates unforgettable customer experiences, and keeps you top of mind long after the interaction.
🛠️ Consultative Merch Strategy (Not Transactional Orders)
Ethan's team doesn't just take orders — they ask questions, uncover goals, and design campaigns that amplify the experience and ROI.
💡 Trade Show Secrets for Higher Traffic
Don't just hand out random bags. Create interactive experiences at your booth — games, challenges, giveaways — and watch traffic triple.
💸 Quality Over Quantity — Every Time
One high-quality item beats 1,000 cheap ones that no one wants. People remember the feel, the fit, and the experience.
🤖 How Indigo Uses AI (The Smart Way)
AI helps Ethan's team ideate, avoid mistakes, and improve efficiency — but it doesn't replace high-touch service or human-level communication.
🤝 Service Is the Sales Advantage
Ethan trains his team to "advance the position" with every interaction — stay positive, build connection, and play the long game.
🎯 The One Thing Every Brand Should Implement: A Thank You Program
A thoughtful, well-designed welcome gift or first-purchase surprise can instantly elevate your experience and improve customer retention.
 
 
Key Takeaways
▪️Persistence Pays Off
You might be one call away from everything changing. Keep dialing.
▪️Reverse Engineer Your Merch
Start with the outcome, not the item.
▪️Quality Wins Long Term
Cheap merch hurts your brand. Premium merch builds loyalty.
▪️Experience | Item
What people feel matters more than what they wear.
▪️Ask More Questions
Great merch companies — and great salespeople — uncover the story behind the order.
▪️AI Elevates Ideas, Not Execution
Use it to think bigger, not to replace the human touch.
▪️Relationships Build Revenue
Play for 10-year clients, not one-project payouts.
 
 
How to Connect with Ethan Dowie
📱 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ethandowie/  
📱LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethandowie/
💬 Message him the word "MERCH" for a free 20-minute consult
🏢 Company: Indigo — premium branded merch built with strategy, intention, and unmatched customer experience.
 
 
🎯 Call to Action
Call The Damn Leads
"By sales professionals, for sales professionals - Tales of your wildest sales stories and tactics to succeed in your sales career across various industries."
Join Drewbie Wilson, a sales veteran with over 20 years of experience, as he brings you insider stories, humor, and actionable strategies to excel in your sales journey.
Your weekly dose of:
Wild Sales Stories: Engaging tales of real-life sales adventures.

Proven Tactics: Actionable strategies to boost your sales game.

Humor: A fun and energetic perspective on the world of sales.

Expert Insights: Learn from seasoned professionals in various industries.

Don't miss out on the insights, humor, and strategies that can take your sales career to new heights! Sales professionals, entrepreneurs, and small business owners striving to enhance their sales, marketing, and personal growth to achieve financial success and time freedom.
If you'd like to be a guest on our show please leave your contact information and a brief message selling us on what makes your story worth sharing!
https://callthedamnleads.com/pages/podcast
Follow Drewbie: https://www.facebook.com/drewbierides

Follow Call The Damn Leads: https://www.instagram.com/callthedamnleads

Lidia Axe – Business Coach for Solopreneurs, Sales Mindset Strategist, Author, Host of "Conversations That Convert"
In this episode, Drewbie is joined by the fiery, hilarious, and deeply insightful Lidia Axe, a former corporate director turned business coach who helps solopreneurs overcome the mindset blocks stopping them from selling with confidence.
Lidia shares her transformational sales story—how a kids club turned into a boutique gift shop, and how her passion for the products helped her understand one of the most important principles in sales:
👉 If you deeply believe in the value of what you sell, selling becomes easy.
The conversation dives into the emotional and ego-driven struggles of coaches and consultants, why so many hide behind certifications, and why starting the conversation is the most important (and most avoided) step.
From pitch-slapping, to ego death, to corporate conditioning, to the "discotheque problem," Lidia breaks down exactly why so many solopreneurs avoid outreach and how to fix it with a mindset shift that puts the buyer—not the seller—at the center.
This episode is LOADED with real talk, practical reframes, and a refreshing perspective every coach, consultant, or new business owner needs to hear.
 
 
Episode Highlights
Why Lidia once believed she would "never be good at sales"



How passion for her products turned her into a natural salesperson



The boutique kids shop that accidentally taught her the truth about selling



Why believing in your offer eliminates fear, sleaze, and pressure



The trap of waiting "to be picked" in business (the discotheque analogy)



Why most solopreneurs lack a sales problem—they have a conversation problem



The pitch-slap epidemic: leading with an offer before you know the person



Why certifications become a socially validated form of procrastination



How corporate conditioning keeps coaches stuck collecting acronyms



Ego death: why transitioning from corporate to solopreneurship is so emotionally hard



The danger of hiding behind endless learning instead of client acquisition



Why clients don't care about your certifications—they care about their problem



How to reframe your fear of judgment and shift to a service-led approach



Why "coaching" is not the business—it's simply one tool in your toolbox



How to stay human, start conversations, and build real relationships



 
 
Key Takeaways
1. Selling is easy when you believe in the value.
Passion and certainty make conversations natural—not salesy.
2. Stop waiting to be picked.
If you don't start the conversation, you're standing in the corner of the discotheque forever.
3. Certifications do not replace clients.
You are not in corporate anymore. You don't need 19 letters after your name—you need conversations.
4. Learning is safe. Outreach is scary.
Most coaches bury themselves in training to avoid rejection.
5. Shift the focus OFF yourself.
When you focus on the person you're helping, selling becomes service, not pressure.
6. Clients don't care about your tools.
They care about whether you can fix their problem.
Tools ≠ value.
Results = value.
7. Ego death is part of becoming a business owner.
Letting go of identity, titles, and corporate validation is essential.
8. Start with a normal human conversation—not a pitch.
No one likes a pitch-slap. Build the relationship first.
9. Your offer is not about you—it's about the job it does for the client.
People buy outcomes, not methodologies.
 
 
Connect with Lidia
🔗 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lidia-chmel/
🌐 Website: https://www.skool.com/a-zone/about
💬 Sends DMs, welcomes conversations—but NO pitch-slapping!
 
 
📣 Call to Action
CALL THE DAMN LEADS
"By sales professionals, for sales professionals."
Each week, host Drewbie Wilson brings real-world sales wisdom, humor, and high-energy conversations designed to help you become a better communicator, closer, and leader.
Expect a powerful mix of:
🔥 Real Sales Stories
🔧 Proven Sales Tactics
🎙️ Expert Interviews
⚡ Humor, Mindset & Motivation
📈 Practical, usable strategies you can implement today
Whether you're a salesperson, coach, consultant, or entrepreneur—this show will sharpen your skills, boost your confidence, and help you close more deals by simply…
👉 Calling the damn leads.
Want to be a guest?
Share your story here:
👉 https://callthedamnleads.com/pages/podcast
 
 
Follow Drewbie
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/drewbierides
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/callthedamnleads

Dr. Chris Gray – Consumer Psychologist, Founder of The Bycologist, Behavioral Marketing Expert
In this episode, Drewbie sits down with world-renowned consumer psychologist Dr. Chris Gray, whose three decades of experience in marketing, psychology, and behavioral science have helped brands decode how customers actually think, feel, and buy.
Dr. Gray shares an unbelievable story from early in his career—a sales meeting gone wrong that turned into one of the most transformative projects of his life. What began as a devastating rejection ended with multimillion-dollar partnerships, a groundbreaking "Shopper Passport" experience, and a deep truth he carries into every project today:
👉 Experience is undeniable.
Through the power of curiosity, psychological insight, and immersive customer empathy, Dr. Gray helps businesses understand their buyers better than their competitors ever will. This episode is PACKED with wisdom on consumer behavior, emotional decision-making, customer journeys, and the psychology behind why people choose one brand over another.
If you want to sharpen your marketing, elevate your sales conversations, and truly understand your customers' inner world… this episode is a masterclass.
 
 
Episode Highlights
The shocking sales meeting meltdown that almost ended his career



How a single bad experience shaped a pharmaceutical exec's explosive reaction



Why consumer psychology became Dr. Gray's differentiator



The creation of the "Shopper Passport" immersive research program



What happens when you make executives live their customers' struggles



Running a 700-person nationwide consumer immersion with 17 retailers



Why experience is undeniable when trying to understand your customers



How curiosity drives great salespeople



The danger of assuming you "already know your customer"



Why avatars & journey maps alone aren't enough



Intellectual humility as a competitive advantage



Why the ability to ask "What don't I know?" opens more sales doors



How Dr. Gray sells without "selling"—teaching, value, and insight



Why deep customer understanding creates an unfair advantage



 
 
Key Takeaways
1. Immersive experience beats assumptions.
When you feel what the customer feels, your strategy changes forever.
2. Curiosity is the salesperson's secret weapon.
If you're not asking "What don't I know?" you're already falling behind.
3. Consumer behavior changes constantly.
The moment you assume you know everything, you stop learning—and stop selling.
4. Intellectual humility creates better customer insights.
Let go of certainty. Replace it with questions.
5. The best sales conversations start with empathy.
Understanding emotional tension, constraints, motivations, and trade-offs leads to deeper connection.
6. Teaching is selling.
The more value you share, the more people want to work with you.
7. Whoever understands their customer best… wins.
Wins the sale.
Wins loyalty.
Wins lifetime customers.
8. The psychology of buying is a competitive advantage.
Understanding how and why people decide is more important than what you sell.
9. Experience is undeniable.
You can't argue with what you've lived. Neither can your customers.
 
 
Connect with Dr. Chris Gray
🔗 Website: https://thebycologist.com
📰 Newsletter: Monthly deep dive into consumer psychology & application
✍️ Substack: The Bycologist – Consumer behavior, insights & strategy
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drchris (handle: Dr. Chris)
 
 
Call to Action
CALL THE DAMN LEADS
"By sales professionals, for sales professionals."
Each week, Drewbie Wilson brings humor, heart, and real-world sales wisdom from 20+ years in the game.
Expect a wild mix of:
🔥 Real Sales Stories — entertaining, relatable, and packed with lessons
🔧 Proven Tactics — practical, repeatable strategies for better sales
😆 Humor & Energy — because sales should be fun
🎤 Expert Interviews — gain insights from pros across industries
Whether you're in sales, an entrepreneur, or scaling your business, these conversations will help you grow.
Want to be a guest? Pitch your story here:
👉 https://callthedamnleads.com/pages/podcast
 
Follow Drewbie
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/drewbierides
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/callthedamnleads

In this episode, Drewbie welcomes the brilliant and authentic Melanie Gorman, a trained mental health therapist turned powerhouse sales strategist and business builder. Melanie shares her unconventional path—from therapist and bartender to selling for John Gray (Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus) and eventually launching her own company, Crownsville Media.
She breaks down how relationship psychology gives you an unfair edge in sales, why authenticity dissolves pressure, and how slowing the conversation creates more sales opportunities—not fewer. Melanie dives into the real fears entrepreneurs face when leaving a stable job, how she built her business by doing every role herself, and how evidence-based confidence helps you grow faster without burning out.
If you're a sales professional, coach, consultant, or therapist wanting to sell without feeling "salesy," this episode is your blueprint.
 
 
Episode Highlights
How Melanie transitioned from therapist → bartender → relationship-focused salesperson



Working with John Gray at the height of Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus



Why authentic conversations outperform aggressive scripts



How to slow down the sales process to reduce anxiety on both sides



Why people will refer you even when they don't buy



The moment Melanie realized she needed to build her own business



How she grew Crownsville Media by mastering every role before delegating



Building confidence through evidence, not emotion



Why leaders should share goals, limitations, and expectations transparently



The 80% rule: perfection isn't required for success



Marketing as a "pie chart"—do what fits your time, budget, and energy



How to stay ahead of your competition through constant learning



Using content, SEO, and strategy to be found by the right clients



Why unique naming matters for branding (like Crownsville Media!)



 
 
Key Takeaways
1. Sales anxiety drops when you remember the buyer is more anxious than you.
Lead with compassion and curiosity.
2. Authentic conversations are more memorable than perfect scripts.
People buy from people who make them feel understood.
3. Confidence grows from evidence.
Keep your wins visible—your brain needs reminders.
4. A "no" today can still become a referral tomorrow.
Good relationships outlast individual transactions.
5. You don't need a massive team—just a clear vision.
Align your people, define expectations, and support them.
6. Marketing is long-term—not a one-and-done task.
Websites, content, SEO, and messaging must all work together.
7. Stay educated to stay valuable.
If you stop learning, you stop growing.
 
 
Connect with Melanie
🔗 Website: https://crownsvillemedia.com
📅 Consultation: Book a call directly through her site
📘 Specialty: Websites, SEO, and marketing systems for therapists & service providers
 
 
Call to Action
CALL THE DAMN LEADS
"By sales professionals, for sales professionals."
Each week, Drewbie Wilson brings humor, heart, and real-world sales wisdom from 20+ years in the game.
Expect a wild mix of:
🔥 Real Sales Stories — entertaining, relatable, and packed with lessons
🔧 Proven Tactics — practical, repeatable strategies for better sales
😆 Humor & Energy — because sales should be fun
🎤 Expert Interviews — gain insights from pros across industries
Whether you're in sales, an entrepreneur, or scaling your business, these conversations will help you grow.
Want to be a guest? Pitch your story here:
👉 https://callthedamnleads.com/pages/podcast
 
 
Follow Drewbie
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/drewbierides
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/callthedamnleads