The Argument

Watch the official trailer for The Argument — a new podcast cohosted by Jerusalem Demsas and Matthew Yglesias.
Has affirmative action gone too far? Should we abolish internet anonymity? Is liberal hypocrisy worth defending?
Welcome to The Argument, a weekly podcast from Jerusalem Demsas and Matthew Yglesias, where two friends argue about politics, policy, and whatever else is on their minds.
This is a debate show for people who want the nitty-gritty without the typical screaming matches or softball interviews. Each week, one host argues a distinctive point of view — armed with facts and research, not just pundit bluster — and then Matthew and Jerusalem hash it out.
New episodes post every Thursday, starting April 9.
You can find The Argument on Substack, YouTube, and wherever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube | Overcast | Pocket Casts
The Argument is produced by Justin Zuckerman, fact-checked by Eli Richman, with music by Breakmaster Cylinder and art by Ben Tousley. To watch an ad-free version of this episode, become a paid subscriber at TheArgumentMag.com

Are men naturally promiscuous and drawn to younger women? Are women obsessed with tall, older, rich men? Dating discourse is littered with pop evolutionary psychology that makes broad claims about how men and women are under a thin veneer of scientific credibility. But how much of it is backed by real science?
In this episode of The Argument, host Jerusalem Demsas interviews UC Davis psychology professor Paul Eastwick about his new book, Bonded by Evolution: The New Science of Love and Connection. Eastwick breaks down some of the memes and myths about what evolutionary psychology really says about attraction and how we fall for each other.
The Argument is a podcast dedicated to honest, unflinching debate about the biggest questions facing democracy, culture, and our future. As the host, Editor-in-Chief Jerusalem Demsas brings together voices across the political spectrum to argue, challenge, and persuade. Each episode is a space where disagreements are confronted directly, with clarity and conviction, rather than hidden or shouted down.
For a full-length, ad-free version of our podcast, you can become a paid subscriber. You can watch the full version with ads for free by subscribing to our YouTube channel. The audio version is also available wherever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube | Overcast | Pocket Casts
The Argument podcast with Jerusalem Demsas is available wherever you get podcasts. New shows drop every Monday. If you like the show, leave a comment and ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.
Articles, studies, and posts referenced in the episode can be found on our website.
The Argument is produced by Justin Zuckerman, fact-checked by Eli Richman, with music by Breakmaster Cylinder and art by Ben Tousley. To watch an ad-free version of this episode, become a paid subscriber at TheArgumentMag.com

Economists love to say there are no free lunches. Jennifer Doleac thinks criminal justice is one of the rare places where that’s wrong.
In this episode, host and Editor of The Argument, Jerusalem Demsas talks with Doleac—economist and author of The Science of Second Chances—about what happens when you treat crime policy like an empirical problem instead of a morality play. 
Rejecting the false choice of being "tough on crime" or "soft on crime," Doleac surfaces a surprising number of reforms that can reduce crime and make the system more fair.
The Argument is a podcast dedicated to honest, unflinching debate about the biggest questions facing democracy, culture, and our future. As the host, Demsas brings together voices across the political spectrum to argue, challenge, and persuade. Each episode is a space where disagreements are confronted directly, with clarity and conviction, rather than hidden or shouted down.
We want to hear from you! If you liked the episode, disagreed with it, or have a guest or episode suggestion, reach out at [email protected].
For a full-length, ad-free version of our podcast, you can become a paid subscriber. You can watch the full version with ads for free by subscribing to our YouTube channel. The audio version is also available wherever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube | Overcast | Pocket Casts
The Argument podcast with Jerusalem Demsas is available wherever you get podcasts. New shows drop every Monday. If you like the show, leave a comment and ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.
Articles, studies, and posts referenced in the episode can be found on our website.

The Argument is produced by Justin Zuckerman, fact-checked by Eli Richman, with music by Breakmaster Cylinder and art by Ben Tousley. To watch an ad-free version of this episode, become a paid subscriber at TheArgumentMag.com

Trump didn’t just reshape the GOP—he may have ended what we used to call “the conservative movement.” 
New York Times columnist Ross Douthat joins host Jerusalem Demsas to map the new right: the collapse of fusionism, the rise of nationalism, and a media ecosystem where influencers matter more than institutions.
Then they argue about what liberalism can and can’t solve. Can abundance and faster growth stabilize democracy, or are the deeper crises cultural, spiritual, and demographic in ways GDP can’t fix? 
The Argument is a podcast dedicated to honest, unflinching debate about the biggest questions facing democracy, culture, and our future. As the host, Editor-in-Chief Jerusalem Demsas brings together voices across the political spectrum to argue, challenge, and persuade. Each episode is a space where disagreements are confronted directly, with clarity and conviction, rather than hidden or shouted down.
We want to hear from you! If you liked the episode, disagreed with it, or have a guest or episode suggestion, reach out at [email protected].
For a full-length, ad-free version of our podcast, you can become a paid subscriber. You can watch the full version with ads for free by subscribing to our YouTube channel. The audio version is also available wherever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube | Overcast | Pocket Casts
The Argument podcast with Jerusalem Demsas is available wherever you get podcasts. New shows drop every Monday. If you like the show, leave a comment and ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.
Articles, studies, and posts referenced in the episode can be found on our website.

The Argument is produced by Justin Zuckerman, fact-checked by Eli Richman, with music by Breakmaster Cylinder and art by Ben Tousley. To watch an ad-free version of this episode, become a paid subscriber at TheArgumentMag.com

Over less than 25 years, the opioid epidemic killed over 800,000 Americans. These deaths and the resulting economic and political ramifications were unequally distributed across the country. Some places were ravaged, others barely noticed what was happening. 
In this episode, host Jerusalem Demsas is joined by economist Carolina Arteaga to unpack new research linking the opioid crisis to increasing vote share for the Republican party. They dig into how a public-health catastrophe came to be a law and order issue, how conservative-leaning media covered the crisis differently, and how much of the shift can really be chalked up to persuasion. Plus: the surprising fertility finding in hard-hit areas and what it might say about opportunity and family formation.
The Argument is a podcast dedicated to honest, unflinching debate about the biggest questions facing democracy, culture, and our future. As the host, Editor-in-Chief Jerusalem Demsas brings together voices across the political spectrum to argue, challenge, and persuade. Each episode is a space where disagreements are confronted directly, with clarity and conviction, rather than hidden or shouted down.
We want to hear from you! If you liked the episode, disagreed with it, or have a guest or episode suggestion, reach out at [email protected].
For a full-length, ad-free version of our podcast, you can become a paid subscriber. You can watch the full version with ads for free by subscribing to our YouTube channel. The audio version is also available wherever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube | Overcast | Pocket Casts
The Argument podcast with Jerusalem Demsas is available wherever you get podcasts. New shows drop every Monday. If you like the show, leave a comment and ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.
Articles, studies, and posts referenced in the episode can be found on our website.

The Argument is produced by Justin Zuckerman, fact-checked by Eli Richman, with music by Breakmaster Cylinder and art by Ben Tousley. To watch an ad-free version of this episode, become a paid subscriber at TheArgumentMag.com