Second in Command: The Chief Behind the Chief with Cameron Herold

What if your next big business breakthrough started with owning your own blind spots?
This Fan Favorite episode throws you in the trenches with Cameron Herold and SaaS Academy's former COO and current CEO Matt Verlachi, as they go far beyond surface-level business banter. From surviving firefighting chaos to building, selling, and now scaling SaaS Academy, Matt Verlachi exposes the real skills that make or break Second in Commands.
They unpack why customer obsession cures more growth headaches than any software, how to weaponize one-on-ones for radical team development, and what most COOs get dead wrong about CEO dynamics.
Miss this? You risk coasting on old habits while others engineer unfair advantages. Listen now for hard-won tactics you won’t find in any business course from the world’s largest SaaS coaching engine.


Timestamped Highlights
00:45 – The firefighting mindset that built decisive business instincts
05:56 – The overlooked power of “small unit” teams to unlock real growth
09:44 – Are you a COO trapped in a CEO’s title? The unexpected identity test
13:43 – Brutal truths about customer obsession and why most leaders fail here
16:18 – The lesson no founder learns soon enough when selling their company
18:22 – The surprising reason joining SaaS Academy changed his life
21:31 – The founder’s hidden block: How self-worth destroys pricing
27:31 – The counterintuitive leadership split that 10x’d their decision speed
41:07 – How his “full-person” one-on-ones rip open performance breakthroughs



About the Guest
Matt Verlaque was the former COO of SaaS Academy (now Precision), steering operational strategy for the largest coaching platform serving B2B SaaS entrepreneurs. With first-hand experience ranging from firefighting to founding and selling a SaaS startup, he delivers operating wisdom forged under real pressure. He is currently serving as the CEO at Precision, where they help growth-minded founders understand how their business actually works so they can scale with clarity, not chaos.
🔗 LinkedIn | Website

Mentioned Resources
Great CEO Within by Matt Mochary
Joe Polish / Genius Network
1-800-GOT-JUNK
Dan Martell
Shopify (Tobias Lütke, Harley Finkelstein)
CrossFit
UP Launch



Important Links
Connect with Cameron: Website | LinkedIn
Explore the COO Alliance - The World’s Leading Community for Seconds in Command
Get Cameron’s book: Second in Command: Unleash the Power of Your COO Book
Take his course: Invest In Your Leaders Online Course (Use promo code PODCAST10 before the end of the month for 10% off)
Chat or video call with AI Cameron via Delphi



Note: This Fan Favorite episode is a recast of one of our most impactful interviews, still packed with insights for second-in-command leaders. Whether it’s your first listen or a revisit, there’s timeless value inside.


The Second in Command Podcast is an original production hosted by Cameron Herold. Brought to you by COO Alliance. Production and editing by Podcast Your Brand.

What happens when you try to build a global movement teaching people how to breathe in an industry exploding with competition?
Gary Torrens, co-founder and Second in Command at Soma Breath, sits down with Cameron Herold to reveal what most operators never say out loud. This conversation punches into operational realities: remote chaos, hiring struggles, visionary partner dynamics, and the brutal truth about what actually works when building a scalable certification business.
Breathwork is everywhere, but Soma Breath’s story is different. You’ll hear how they went from wild psilocybin-fueled vision quests in Thailand to leading thousands of facilitators and facing the tough tradeoffs of pricing, growth, and culture. If you want to understand the Second in Command power dynamic and see the inside of a company growing faster than most can handle, this episode is your shortcut.
Listen now or risk missing the real-world roadmap and the costly mistakes that separate scalable movements from also-rans. Only here: Gary’s unfiltered answers and their playbook for the next stage.

This episode is brought to you by our Silver Sponsor, Next Level Growth.
They help COOs and leadership teams build Elite Organizations through a proven, customizable framework built around the Five Obsessions of Elite Organizations.
If you and your leadership team are ready to operate at the next level, take the Elite Organizations Assessment and receive a free 20-page customized report based on your answers, plus a complimentary one-hour coaching session with a Next Level Growth Partner and Business Guide to begin implementing tools that will help you build an even more elite business.
Complete the assessment here to get started - nextlevelgrowth.com/cooassessment

Timestamped Highlights
06:53 – The unexpected business model nobody saw coming
10:14 – Ancient breathing meets modern science: the strategy that sparked a movement
13:10 – Why they priced the membership low—and the hidden risks
17:16 – Remote chaos: problems they never saw coming with a global team
22:10 – The controversial move to focus on city-based expansion
24:19 – The real marketing mess they had to fix after explosive growth
27:08 – The truth behind their biggest revenue engine
34:07 – Gary’s brutal leadership lesson that changed everything

About the Guest
Gary Torrens is co-founder and COO of Soma Breath. He helped turn a visionary idea blending ancient breathwork, modern science, and music into a global certification platform with 4,000+ facilitators. With a background in physics, finance, and digital marketing, Gary is known for building systems that scale impact, not just revenue.
🔗 LinkedIn | Website

Mentioned Resources
Mindvalley
Zumba
CrossFit
EOS
Calm
Lovable
Jason Campbell
Chip Wilson (Lululemon)
Sam Skelly
Vishen Lakhiani (Mindvalley founder)
Ayahuasca, DMT, 5-MeO-DMT, Ketamine (psychedelics referenced)
The Renegade Pharmacist

Important Links
Connect with Cameron: Website | LinkedIn
Explore the COO Alliance - The World’s Leading Community for Seconds in Command
Get Cameron’s book: Second in Command: Unleash the Power of Your COO Book
Take his course: Invest In Your Leaders Online Course (Use promo code PODCAST10 before the end of the month for 10% off)
Chat or video call with AI Cameron via Delphi

The Second in Command Podcast is an original production hosted by Cameron Herold. Brought to you by COO Alliance. Production and editing by Podcast Your Brand.

This episode is brought to you by our Silver Sponsor, Next Level Growth.
They help COOs and leadership teams build Elite Organizations through a proven, customizable framework built around the Five Obsessions of Elite Organizations.
If you and your leadership team are ready to operate at the next level, take the Elite Organizations Assessment and receive a free 20-page customized report based on your answers, plus a complimentary one-hour coaching session with a Next Level Growth Partner and Business Guide to begin implementing tools that will help you build an even more elite business.
Complete the assessment here to get started - nextlevelgrowth.com/cooassessment

What if everything you know about starting and scaling a bank is wrong?
In this Fan Favorite episode, Cameron Herold uncovers the real story behind WIO Bank with former COO Jamal Al Awadhi, a leader fueling the UAE’s platform banking revolution. From Abu Dhabi’s government-driven vision to the ferocious war for top talent, Jamal lays out how to break tradition, lead through chaos, and unlock transformative team culture.
If you skip this episode, you’ll miss out on first-hand insights into word-of-mouth-driven growth, the secret sauce for hiring resilient operators, and the unfiltered truth about working with sovereign wealth funds. Listen now to tap hard-won lessons you won’t find anywhere else. Your next strategic leap could depend on it.

Timestamped Highlights
01:13 – The immigrant mindset shaping global leadership grit
06:04 – The real reason WIO Bank launched in the UAE—exposed
09:09 – Unpacking painful problems traditional banking ignored
14:00 – Did regulations crush or catalyze digital banking?
15:42 – Competing with legacy players: a blunt take on building trust
18:04 – Why word-of-mouth blew up WIO’s customer growth overnight
26:57 – The resilience litmus test: how to hire for hypergrowth chaos
37:02 – Inside the CEO-COO dynamic that keeps a rocketship on track
43:36 – Game-changing leadership lessons that rewired Jamal’s style

About the Guest
Jamal Al Awadhi was the Chief Operating Officer of WIO Bank, Abu Dhabi’s breakout digital platform bank. With over a decade in marketing, strategy, and operations across industries, Jamal blends international perspective with deep regional expertise to drive game-changing innovation and hypergrowth at one of the UAE’s fastest-scaling financial disruptors. Currently, he is the CEO of Al Hilal Bank.
🔗 Website

Mentioned Resources
WIO Bank
ADQ Investment Bank
InterNations
Dynamite Circle
Henley Business School
1-800-GOT-JUNK

Important Links
Connect with Cameron: Website | LinkedIn
Explore the COO Alliance - The World’s Leading Community for Seconds in Command
Get Cameron’s book: Second in Command: Unleash the Power of Your COO Book
Take his course: Invest In Your Leaders Online Course (Use promo code PODCAST10 before the end of the month for 10% off)
Chat or video call with AI Cameron via Delphi

Note: This Fan Favorite episode is a recast of one of our most impactful interviews, still packed with insights for second-in-command leaders. Whether it’s your first listen or a revisit, there’s timeless value inside.

The Second in Command Podcast is an original production hosted by Cameron Herold. Brought to you by COO Alliance. Production and editing by Podcast Your Brand.

Are you secretly running on empty, wondering if burnout is targeting you next?
In this episode, Alen Voskanian, COO of Cedars-Sinai Medical Network and author, pulls back the curtain on the raw realities beneath operations leadership. From the constant grind of clinical environments to the personal toll of endless firefighting, Voskanian exposes why burnout hits high performers hardest and how ignoring your creative side can quietly sabotage your impact. This isn’t just about wellness platitudes. It’s a real-world look at chasing fulfillment, designing systems that beat chaos, and the unexpected arts that make leaders resilient.
If you’re a COO (or run with one), you can’t afford to miss these insights. The game has changed. Listen now or risk staying stuck in cycles that will bury both your team and your spirit. This is the side of leadership nobody else is showing you.

Sponsored by
Genius Network - An exclusive community for highly successful entrepreneurs, connecting you with top-tier leaders, strategic insights, and powerful relationships to help you grow your business faster and smarter.
Learn more: https://www.geniusnetwork.com/

Timestamped Highlights
00:25 – The real reason burnout is rampant among COOs and physicians
04:12 – The under-the-radar roles that secretly prepared him for operations
07:29 – Three unconventional ways to master leadership fast
12:18 – Why stand-up comedy became his secret tool for resilience
15:57 – The hidden danger in neglecting your creative life as a leader
19:53 – Brutal realities of burnout nobody is willing to admit
29:55 – How lean principles are quietly transforming healthcare operations
39:09 – What people on their deathbeds taught him about fulfillment and regret

About the Guest
Alen Voskanian, MD, MBA, is the Vice President and COO of Cedars-Sinai Medical Network. A board-certified physician in Family Medicine and Hospice & Palliative Medicine, he’s also an author and sought-after keynote speaker. Alen is known for transforming healthcare to improve access and quality. He holds degrees from UC Berkeley, UC Irvine, and an MBA from Indiana University. He’s a former innovation advisor for CMS, a Cunniff-Dixon/Hastings Center Physician Award winner, and a Health Innovators Fellow with the Aspen Global Leadership Network.
🔗 LinkedIn | Website

Mentioned Resources
“Reclaiming the Joy of Medicine” by Alen Voskanian
Indiana University School of Medicine – Physician MBA track
Ryan Holiday, “The Daily Dad”
Lean, Six Sigma, and performance improvement frameworks
LinkedIn (as a platform for learning and connection)
Coursera (for free courses)
Clean Six Sigma concepts from Toyota production

About the Co-Host
Sivana Brewer is a Fractional COO for Remote Teams and former COO at Closers.io, where she helped scale the company to multiple eight figures and built over 500+ sales teams in just 2.5 years. She specializes in leadership development, remote operations, and systems that empower teams to grow sustainably.
🔗 Connect with Sivana on LinkedIn

Important Links
Connect with Cameron: Website | LinkedIn
Explore the COO Alliance - The World’s Leading Community for Seconds in Command
Get Cameron’s book: Second in Command: Unleash the Power of Your COO Book
Take his course: Invest In Your Leaders Online Course (Use promo code PODCAST10 before the end of the month for 10% off)
Chat or video call with AI Cameron via Delphi

The Second in Command Podcast is an original production hosted by Cameron Herold. Brought to you by COO Alliance. Production and editing by Podcast Your Brand.

Sponsored by
Genius Network - An exclusive community for highly successful entrepreneurs, connecting you with top-tier leaders, strategic insights, and powerful relationships to help you grow your business faster and smarter.
Learn more: https://www.geniusnetwork.com/

What do you risk when you run a mission-driven campaign that breaks every rule in politics? Amaryllis Kennedy isn’t just directing the KENNEDY24 presidential campaign. She’s rewriting the playbook on grassroots leadership, digital disruption, and brutal operational honesty.
In this Fan Favorite unfiltered episode, Cameron Herold dives deep with Amaryllis on the real strategies behind building a nimble, values-first organization in the most polarized landscape imaginable. She reveals the raw tension of building trust, keeping chaos at bay, and rescuing authenticity from a world addicted to power and performance. Hard-won lessons from Silicon Valley and the CIA collide with everyday realities of parenting, digital activism, and fighting the system from the inside.
If you miss this conversation, you miss the forbidden playbook on what leadership really looks like when the stakes are generational. Listen now for a front-row seat on strategy you won’t get anywhere else and discover why the real power lies in what you’re willing to disrupt.

Timestamped Highlights
00:44 – The counterintuitive campaign strategy that energizes a disillusioned public
05:17 – Why young people are secretly shaping America’s future
08:05 – How breaking political storytelling rules actually breaks through
13:04 – The brutal inside story behind government overreach
19:47 – A behind-the-scenes look into a campaign where careers are truly on the line
24:00 – The ballot access chaos that forces real innovation
30:31 – Why authenticity beats perfection in a runaway grassroots movement
35:32 – Democratizing campaign fundraising with bold gamified tactics
47:44 – The sacred job of protecting your leader so they can really listen
59:35 – The surprising benefit of Sabbath-style strategy in hypergrowth

About the Guest
Amaryllis Fox Kennedy is a former CIA intelligence officer, author, and advocate focused on diplomacy, conflict resolution, and public policy. She is the bestselling author of Life Undercover: Coming of Age in the CIA and host of Netflix’s The Business of Drugs. She also served as a senior advisor and campaign surrogate during Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s 2024 presidential campaign. She currently serves as Deputy Director of National Intelligence for Policy and Capabilities.
🔗 Website

Mentioned Resources
KENNEDY24 campaign
Netflix – The Business of Drugs
Apple – TV series based on Amaryllis's memoir
Bobby Kennedy Jr.
Conde Nast
Hearst
Genius Network
Burning Man
Twitter (as previous tech experience)
Georgetown University
Oxford University
Brown University (used as a reference for war statistics)

Important Links
Connect with Cameron: Website | LinkedIn
Explore the COO Alliance - The World’s Leading Community for Seconds in Command
Get Cameron’s book: Second in Command: Unleash the Power of Your COO Book
Take his course: Invest In Your Leaders Online Course (Use promo code PODCAST10 before the end of the month for 10% off)
Chat or video call with AI Cameron via Delphi

Note: This Fan Favorite episode is a recast of one of our most impactful interviews, still packed with insights for second-in-command leaders. Whether it’s your first listen or a revisit, there’s timeless value inside.

The Second in Command Podcast is an original production hosted by Cameron Herold. Brought to you by COO Alliance. Production and editing by Podcast Your Brand.