Makers & Mystics

What does it mean to glorify God through art?
For many artists, the desire to glorify God can become an expectation that their work should communicate an explicitly religious message. But what happens when that expectation begins to constrict the artist? What if our attempts to make art that clearly communicates faith actually prevent the art from becoming genuinely transformative?
In this solo meditation, Stephen Roach explores the relationship between Christian faith, artistic freedom, and the glory of God. Drawing on the work of Hans Rookmaaker and Flannery O'Connor, as well as the strange prophetic performances of Ezekiel, Isaiah, and Jeremiah, Stephen asks whether art needs to be explicitly religious in order to be spiritually meaningful.
Stephen revisits the story of Paolo Veronese and his controversial painting of The Last Supper, which brought him before the Catholic Inquisition in 1573. The story raises an important question for artists and faith communities alike: what happens when our desire to protect familiar expressions of faith leaves no room for artistic imagination?
Perhaps glorifying God through art doesn't always mean making art that is easily recognizable as Christian. Perhaps sometimes it means following our creative curiosity into places that are unfamiliar, challenging, ambiguous, or even strange.
In a world where familiar religious imagery can become wallpaper, what might happen if we made room for art that surprises us again?
In this episode:
Rethinking what it means to "glorify God" through art
Why treating art as a "tool" for evangelism can strip it of its power
The shocking performance art of Ezekiel, Isaiah, and Jeremiah
Paolo Veronese's controversial Last Supper
How religious conformity can restrict artistic creativity
Why faith communities need to cultivate curiosity rather than judgment
The danger of familiar truths becoming spiritually dull
ABOUT THE HOST
Stephen Roach is the host of Makers and Mystics, a podcast exploring the intersection of creativity, faith, and the human experience. He is an artist, curator, poet, and musician. He is currently writing How to See Invisible Things, a book exploring the future of art and faith. Stephen has spent over a decade advocating for creativity as a spiritual discipline and calling.
RESOURCES AND LINKS
Art Needs No Justification by Hans Rookmaaker — the book referenced for its argument that art has intrinsic value apart from evangelistic use
Five Creativity Killers and How to Avoid Them by Stephen Roach — Stephen's booklet where he first wrote about Paolo Veronese's trial
Disclaimer:
This episode is a case for unconventional art, but I want to be clear that it is not a disparagement of sacred art: work created specifically for devotional or liturgical environments and practices. My critique of “easy art” is not meant to diminish the beauty or value of sacred art.
—Stephen Roach
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Every great artist from Caravaggio to Frida Kahlo has fought the same invisible war, and Stephen Roach makes the case that it is not a coincidence.

In this solo reflection, Stephen traces a decade-long question that has haunted him: why does creative expression seem to attract so much internal and external opposition? Drawing on scripture, church history, and the lives of artists who battled addiction, trauma, and mental illness, he builds a case for why creativity and faith are so deeply intertwined, and why that connection makes artists a centerpiece in a spiritual battle.

He highlights an uncanny parallel between the King of Tyre in Ezekiel 28 and the artisans in Exodus, then lands in the present moment, asking what it means to keep making human art in an age of artificial intelligence. Listeners will walk away with a framework for understanding creative resistance and a renewed sense of why their work matters.

KEY TOPICS COVERED
• Why creativity is rooted in the image of God
• The historical pattern of struggle among great artists, from addiction to mental illness
• The church's complicated relationship with the arts
• What the rise of AI means for the future of human creativity
• Why art may be the last human frontier in an automated world

ABOUT THE HOST
Stephen Roach is the host of Makers and Mystics, a podcast exploring the intersection of creativity, faith, and the human experience. He is an artist, curator, poet, and musician. He is currently writing How to See Invisible Things, a book exploring the inner life of art and faith. Stephen has spent over a decade advocating for creativity as a spiritual discipline.

RESOURCES AND LINKS
The War of Art by Steven Pressfield - referenced for its concept of Resistance and creative struggle
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Evelyn Underhill: The Mother of Modern Mystics
Artist Profile Series 40
Who was Evelyn Underhill, and why does her work continue to shape the modern contemplative movement more than a century later?
In this Artist Profile episode of Makers & Mystics, Stephen Roach explores the life of Evelyn Underhill, writer, spiritual director, retreat leader, and one of the most influential voices on Christian mysticism in the twentieth century.
Although she is often remembered for her landmark book Mysticism, Underhill's own spiritual journey was anything but straightforward. From youthful encounters with transcendent beauty to explorations of the occult, philosophy, and Roman Catholicism, her search eventually led her into the Anglican tradition, where she discovered that mystical experience finds its deepest fulfillment not in extraordinary visions but in the ordinary rhythms of worship, sacrament, and life with Christ.
In an age captivated by spirituality yet often disconnected from historic faith, Evelyn Underhill's life reminds us that the deepest longing of the human heart is not simply for transcendent experiences, but for communion with the living God.
In This Episode
 The surprising spiritual journey that shaped Evelyn Underhill's life 
 How Mysticism became one of the defining books on Christian contemplation 
 Why Underhill believed mystical experience should be part of ordinary Christian life 
 Her friendship with Baron Friedrich von Hügel and its profound influence 
 The relationship between artists, beauty, and the contemplative life 
 Why her final book, Worship, marked the culmination of her life's work 
 What her story offers Christians, artists, and seekers today 
Notable Quotes
"The mystic is called to be a creative artist of the highest kind."

"Beauty is simply Reality seen with the eyes of love."

"Long before we begin searching for God, God has already begun searching for us."

Books Mentioned
Mysticism: A Study in the Nature and Development of Man's Spiritual Consciousness — Evelyn Underhill 
Practical Mysticism — Evelyn Underhill 
Worship — Evelyn Underhill 
Confessions — Augustine of Hippo 
Dark Night of the Soul — St. John of the Cross 
People Mentioned
 Baron Friedrich von Hügel 
 T. S. Eliot 
 Julian of Norwich 
 St. John of the Cross 
 William Blake 
 Augustine of Hippo 
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If this episode encouraged you, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who longs to recover beauty, wonder, and the contemplative life.
To support the ongoing work of Makers & Mystics and gain access to bonus content, join our Patreon community.
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What if art isn't simply something we admire, but something that asks something of us?
In this episode, Stephen Roach sits down with acclaimed printmaker, educator, and storyteller Steve Prince for a conversation about the vocation of the artist. Drawing from history, faith, family, and lived experience, Steve shares how his work seeks to preserve memory, confront injustice, and create spaces where genuine transformation can begin.
From the legacy of the Civil Rights Movement to the power of oral storytelling, from New Orleans kitchen tables to ambitious community art projects, Steve reveals why he believes artists are called to help us "remember to remember" and to imagine a more hopeful future together.
Together they explore:
Why artists are called to be truth-tellers
How history shapes both our imagination and our responsibility
The role of beauty in confronting difficult realities
Why storytelling is essential to healing divided communities
Steve's Kitchen Table project and its vision for reconciliation
Creating art that challenges, invites, and transforms
Faith, social justice, and the spiritual calling of creative work
Helping the next generation of artists embrace both courage and adaptability
Whether you're an artist, educator, historian, or simply someone longing for deeper conversations in a fractured world, this episode offers a vision of art as an act of hospitality, remembrance, and hope.
Quote from the Episode
"The artist helps us remember to remember.""Art isn't made to divide us, it creates a pathway toward who we could become.""Every table has something to teach us." - Steve Prince

Resources Mentioned
Steve Prince's Kitchen Table community art project
Trinity City graphic novel initiative
Howard Thurman
Martin Luther
Medgar Evers
Emmett Till
Rosa Parks
Martin Luther King Jr.
If this episode encouraged you, please consider sharing it with a friend, leaving a review, or supporting the work of Makers & Mystics through Patreon.
Produced by Stephen Roach.
Music by Some Were at Sea.
Keep Creating. The World Needs Your Art. 
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Can beauty change a person? A community? A culture? 

Sacred artist Kate Capato believes it can.

In this bonus episode of Makers & Mystics, Stephen Roach sits down with Kate to explore why authentic beauty has the power to heal, awaken wonder, and draw people into the presence of God. Together they discuss the modern crisis of beauty, the vocation of the artist, and how sacred art becomes an invitation into deeper communion with Christ.

Kate shares why she and her family travel the country as "missionaries of beauty," bringing paintings and music into communities where beauty becomes a catalyst for transformation.

In this episode, you'll discover:

• Why beauty is essential 
• The difference between beauty and prettiness
• Why modern culture is experiencing a crisis of beauty
• The spiritual practice of creating sacred art
• Practical ways anyone can cultivate beauty in everyday life

About Kate Capato

Kate Capato is a sacred artist and founder of Visual Grace. Through commissioned paintings, exhibitions, and speaking events, she helps people encounter the beauty of God through visual art. Together with her husband, she travels throughout the United States sharing sacred art and music as "missionaries of beauty."

Learn more: https://visualgrace.org
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